Lets make changes to PQs

AnnKnight

Active member
Joined
Mar 16, 2020
Messages
122
Best answers
2
IGN
CryosLight
I think one thing to keep in mind is the learning curve for PQs as well.
This is coming from someone that didn't do these PQs for maybe about 8-10 years depending on the PQ.
After doing 500+ PQs (based on my achievement % data) on Croosade, I felt all of them except Escape & Orbis(because I never got to do it) were pretty friendly to learn. Sure I might have had some few ups and downs on some of them but after a few mistakes, you learn from it and get the hang of it.

Escape on other hand has the worst learning curve as one mess up = punished a lot because it's JQ 🤷‍♀️
So yes, you can read a lot of guides, practice how to do it, or someone showing you how to do it but I'm going to tell you, nobody is perfect and you most likely aren't going to get it right the first time. It'll probably take many tries before you get it. My first successful Escape Run took 9 minutes and I had to use sacro from Paladin to 'cheat' it. :p My party members didn't want to do it after.

And even if I see myself mastering it somehow, all that work for that many points to me feels like I went through a large learning curve compared to other PQs that give identical points. You have to put a lot more effort on Escape which isn't inherently a bad thing but doing it for an hour gives room for mistakes because it's slowly tiring you out. To me it shouldn't hurt that much to increase the points by a little bit to "try" to encourage people to go through this learning curve. That way it feels you deserved that A+ you got on the test for your 'hard' work.

To be fair though, I do doubt a small point increase is going to encourage more people to go through the learning curve. :(
 
Last edited:

Friend

Active member
Joined
Jun 5, 2020
Messages
98
Best answers
0
To add on to rods reply to the posts asking about random reward boxes, the reasoning behind not wanting random reward boxes is because although they might make pq more incentivizing and therefore more inviting, it does so in such a chaotic way. Not only is it a whole mess of rewards, but it's also difficult and a waste of time to code. Let's not complicate things by adding huge diversity in all these extra details and just incentivize pq with the items that people run pq for. Making pq a daily will make pq so limiting and make it seem more like a chore. I still still stand behind encouraging diversity of pqs, and I hope it is done through rng or time gated rewards (points or boxes) for unpopular pqs that are tailored to pq shop.

Adding random item rewards (be it through a box or getting an item directly) is something I can get behind.

I think further extra points is better than actual item rewards. If it's items, I'll just do it until I get the random reward I'm looking for and move on. If I get whatever amount of points I'll have to keep pqing to complete the necessary points to trade for the item I wanted initially.
 
Last edited:

Charlie

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 17, 2018
Messages
1,180
Best answers
3
does you hit this time constantly in every round?

seeing how berg data shows all time data for Escape is only 2% kinda show how many people just flat out refuse to do content with high skill ceiling. would to see the upcoming December data to further comment on such claim tho.
Yeah, @Treat and I were both equally good at the JQs and would pick up the slack if one of us (very rarely) messed up. I am a firm believer that anyone can do Escape PQ in close to speed running times just because of how trash I (typically) am at JQs.

People for some reason just get lizard brains and try to brute force them with no reason or rhyme and then rage quit it instead of learning it. Escape PQ is still one of my favorites because it isn’t a brain dead PQ along the likes of Kenta, Ice Knight, or Rex PQ.
 

Heisenberg

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Dec 9, 2017
Messages
1,717
Best answers
4
Updated metrics for November 2020 so far:
Code:
1204: Avg - sec, Median - sec, Lowest - sec, 278 times (8%) (DavyJohn)
1215: Avg 102 sec, Median 91 sec, Lowest 70 sec, 1077 times (30%) (Escape)
1205: Avg 235 sec, Median 218 sec, Lowest 156 sec, 231 times (6%) (RnJ)
1202: Avg 159 sec, Median 151 sec, Lowest 84 sec, 841 times (23%) (Ludi)
1206: Avg 181 sec, Median 169 sec, Lowest 137 sec, 351 times (10%) (PoisonHaze)
1210: Avg 128 sec, Median 109 sec, Lowest 69 sec, 40 times (1%) (DragonRider)
1200: Avg 708 sec, Median 741 sec, Lowest 675 sec, 2 times (0%) (MoonBunny)
1201: Avg 127 sec, Median 118 sec, Lowest 71 sec, 748 times (21%) (Kerning)
1203: Avg 231 sec, Median 228 sec, Lowest 163 sec, 76 times (2%) (Orbis)
1214: Avg 279 sec, Median 279 sec, Lowest 279 sec, 1 time (0%) (Kenta)
(PPQ time is not available due to how it's implemented.)
As you can see, Escape has become the most run PQ. If you ask me I'd say it could use a slight nerf 2300->2150 points or so. PPQ, RnJ, Orbis and maybe PoisonHaze can use another buff.

We still haven't come to a decision (or even much of an opinion) on how exactly to add further incentives. Double rotation sounds fun enough. We could even announce it in a blue notice when it happens, like "[Party Quests] Orbis is on double rotation.". I think it would also be good if we changed the 5x points "jackpot" from 5% chance for 5x to 10% chance for 3x to make that feel more rewarding and a bit less RNG-dependent, especially for the PQs that take longer.


Some computations I did in notepad for the lulz:

1 hour of PQing respectively for a couple different PQs:

Orbis (~230s @ 3300):
16 runs -> 52800 points, 66000 if on rotation
Statistically 16/20*3300*4=10560 bonus points from x5 chance
Total 63360/76560

Kerning (~120s @ 1500):
30 runs -> 45000 points, 56250 if on rotation
Statistically 30/20*1500*4=9000 bonus points from x5 chance
Total 54000/65250

Escape (~95s @ 2300):
37 runs -> 85100 points (lul), 106375 if on rotation (omegalul)
Statistically 37/20*2300*4=17020 bonus points from x5 chance
Total 102120/123395
 

Ezya

Well-known member
Joined
May 6, 2018
Messages
200
Best answers
1
IGN
Ezya
Updated metrics for November 2020 so far:
Code:
1204: Avg - sec, Median - sec, Lowest - sec, 278 times (8%) (DavyJohn)
1215: Avg 102 sec, Median 91 sec, Lowest 70 sec, 1077 times (30%) (Escape)
1205: Avg 235 sec, Median 218 sec, Lowest 156 sec, 231 times (6%) (RnJ)
1202: Avg 159 sec, Median 151 sec, Lowest 84 sec, 841 times (23%) (Ludi)
1206: Avg 181 sec, Median 169 sec, Lowest 137 sec, 351 times (10%) (PoisonHaze)
1210: Avg 128 sec, Median 109 sec, Lowest 69 sec, 40 times (1%) (DragonRider)
1200: Avg 708 sec, Median 741 sec, Lowest 675 sec, 2 times (0%) (MoonBunny)
1201: Avg 127 sec, Median 118 sec, Lowest 71 sec, 748 times (21%) (Kerning)
1203: Avg 231 sec, Median 228 sec, Lowest 163 sec, 76 times (2%) (Orbis)
1214: Avg 279 sec, Median 279 sec, Lowest 279 sec, 1 time (0%) (Kenta)
(PPQ time is not available due to how it's implemented.)
As you can see, Escape has become the most run PQ. If you ask me I'd say it could use a slight nerf 2300->2150 points or so. PPQ, RnJ, Orbis and maybe PoisonHaze can use another buff.

We still haven't come to a decision (or even much of an opinion) on how exactly to add further incentives. Double rotation sounds fun enough. We could even announce it in a blue notice when it happens, like "[Party Quests] Orbis is on double rotation.". I think it would also be good if we changed the 5x points "jackpot" from 5% chance for 5x to 10% chance for 3x to make that feel more rewarding and a bit less RNG-dependent, especially for the PQs that take longer.


Some computations I did in notepad for the lulz:

1 hour of PQing respectively for a couple different PQs:

Orbis (~230s @ 3300):
16 runs -> 52800 points, 66000 if on rotation
Statistically 16/20*3300*4=10560 bonus points from x5 chance
Total 63360/76560

Kerning (~120s @ 1500):
30 runs -> 45000 points, 56250 if on rotation
Statistically 30/20*1500*4=9000 bonus points from x5 chance
Total 54000/65250

Escape (~95s @ 2300):
37 runs -> 85100 points (lul), 106375 if on rotation (omegalul)
Statistically 37/20*2300*4=17020 bonus points from x5 chance
Total 102120/123395
10% for 3x and the blue notice idea is great imo, I like the current PQ meta I don't think we should remove bonus/rotation stuff..

EDIT: maybe if it's easier just add a box for 25 moonlight coins (whatever price depending on rewards) to the shop that you can only buy once weekly and you could add rotating rewards in the box
 
Last edited:

AnnKnight

Active member
Joined
Mar 16, 2020
Messages
122
Best answers
2
IGN
CryosLight
I totally did not see that 1077 times coming for Escape :eek:

The jump from 2% to 30% is incredible.
I am curious if it's the same couple of groups that's constantly running Escape. I guess just the group of people I find during the times I run PQ are not Escape-fans. I am really surprised :eek:

I do like the 10% chance for 3x. Seems reasonable.
Although what about keeping the original bonus chance on top of this new one? That way there's a 5% chance you either get 5x points or a 10% chance you get 3x points. This might complicate it a bit and add more "RNG-dependent" to it.
 
Last edited:

DarkHero7

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 4, 2018
Messages
149
Best answers
0
If you ask me I'd say it could use a slight nerf 2300->2150 points or so.
Yeh if you compare it to the other PQ's and also the points/hour rate its kinda overpowered. This even brings me more to the point why some ppl seem to want to make PQ even more superior than it already is rn. When escape is on rot its like 2 untradable cogs in 1 hour.
 

float

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 6, 2018
Messages
379
Best answers
0
IGN
Alon
Yeh if you compare it to the other PQ's and also the points/hour rate its kinda overpowered. This even brings me more to the point why some ppl seem to want to make PQ even more superior than it already is rn. When escape is on rot its like 2 untradable cogs in 1 hour.
I disagree cos you also have to try twice as hard to min max escape ontop of having a decently hard learning curve I feel like 2.3k points is perfectly balanced.
people arent going to get 1;30 runs on their first 2hours of learning, learning the callouts for maze part + keys part is something people most likely overlook and that increases their run times too.
there's alot more going into min maxing escape compared to others PQs (other than orbis prolly).

I am curious if it's the same couple of groups that's constantly running Escape
yes and thats why the run times are so fast
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Top