MPE Green Potions.

What should we do?


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Bombmouse

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Introduction: Community Insight
This thread's purpose is to garner feedback from the community in regards to specific topics to make sure the server continues to improve and provide a better game-play experience for everyone. Each thread will have it's own respective topic to discuss which will remain open for 1~2 weeks (Longer if need be) and afterwards a poll will be posted for everyone to vote on so we can gauge what should (or shouldn't) be changed!

Polls will usually last a week and then be closed afterwards so be sure to pay attention and vote.

The topics of these threads are discussed and ran by the Admins before being posted to the community and may become a regular thing in the future.

This thread's topic is about MPE Green Potions.

Green Potions

Green potions come from Monster Park Extreme (MPE) and are a potion that give you +1 Attack Speed for 30 minutes.
These potions also allow you to break the Attack Speed cap; Making it so you can attack a lot faster than originally intended.

Normal speed cap is 2, when using a Green MPE pot it gets lowered to 0 (attack speed gets faster the lower the number is). Below are some examples of how this is used.
Most Claws have attack speed 4 (Fast).
2nd job booster is -2, already making you hit the cap under normal circumstances.
When using a Green MPE Pot, your cap becomes 0 and your speed is now 1. If now you additionally use SI, you've reached the new cap.
Most Crossbows have attack speed 6 (Normal).
2nd job booster is -2, making your speed go up to 4 (Fast).
When using a Green MPE pot, your cap becomes 0 and your speed is now 3. If you now additionally use DSI it'll go to 2 and if you have the inner ability (+1 attack speed) you'll have effectively broken the attack speed cap at 1. If you happen to get SI from a TB or Bucc instead of using DSI, your speed would then be 0, reaching the new cap.

Should they be added to the game?
If yes:
explain why; How and/or where should they be obtained from?
If no: please explain why.​
 
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Marcus

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Idk whether I want them or not, but
If they were added I think each person should have to make/acquire it on their own, not just take their pocket change and buy a stack if they got billions and billions laying around.
I also think that there should be a restriction on how often you can make them, so that people use them when they're actually needed, and not to just whack down daily bosses like flies
 

Mufasa

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Hugely against it.
The game has always been against every for of power creep so far.
Holding off on legendary pot for a long time. No equip enhancements. No bonus pots. No nebs.
This potion is quite a form of power creep, which the game doesn't need. Every piece of content in the game is getting cleared now. Adding MPE green potions would only make that easier.
 

DawnAsc

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I believe mpe green potions should be added, as some classes have their weapon choices affected by mpe green potions.
Taking hero for example, we have the choice to use 1h or 2h. However, without mpe green potions we have to be stuck using 2h because 2h already brings us to the speed cap of 2 and using 1h + scrolled shield will which could potentially increase our range further will not increase our att speed any further making them worse than 2h + secondary.
This makes 1h completely unviable for heroes without the presence of mpe green potions.
 

Threat

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Hugely against it.
The game has always been against every for of power creep so far.
Holding off on legendary pot for a long time. No equip enhancements. No bonus pots. No nebs.
This potion is quite a form of power creep, which the game doesn't need. Every piece of content in the game is getting cleared now. Adding MPE green potions would only make that easier.
This game is inherently power creepy and basically becomes solo story for many versions, what's the point in slowing down the inevitability. If you actually cared that there is power creep, you would've suggested something dumb like nerfing on-release AB's because of how disgustingly broken they were. Or maybe suggest the removal of naricains and cauldrons because they're too strong and unneeded.

I'm pretty sure the MPE green pots actually make some classes viable, so I don't see a reason as to why they shouldn't be added.
 

Mufasa

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This game is inherently power creepy and basically becomes solo story for many versions, what's the point in slowing down the inevitability. If you actually cared that there is power creep, you would've suggested something dumb like nerfing on-release AB's because of how disgustingly broken they were. Or maybe suggest the removal of naricains and cauldrons because they're too strong and unneeded.

I'm pretty sure the MPE green pots actually make some classes viable, so I don't see a reason as to why they shouldn't be added.
There is no need to suggest something "dumb" like that, because it's already known .wz changes aren't done such as skill changes.
Removal of stuff that's already in game such as narcs is different from adding things that currently are unavailable.
Because it becomes "solostory" at some point doesn't mean we have to speed that up. If anything, it should be slowed down. At least keep the game party play for as long as is possible. It's an mmo after all.
Also green pots doesn't make some classes viable, since it affects all classes. Classes that are behind will stay behind since the MPE green potion breaks the current speed cap.
 

Threat

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There is no need to suggest something "dumb" like that, because it's already known .wz changes aren't done such as skill changes.
Removal of stuff that's already in game such as narcs is different from adding things that currently are unavailable.
Because it becomes "solostory" at some point doesn't mean we have to speed that up. If anything, it should be slowed down. At least keep the game party play for as long as is possible. It's an mmo after all.
Also green pots doesn't make some classes viable, since it affects all classes. Classes that are behind will stay behind since the MPE green potion breaks the current speed cap.
I mean there was a point where admins decided to add naricains to the game. No one cared that it was a power creep then, how is that situation different from now.

If you want to do content in a party, you are free to do so, but don't try to create some bullshit reasoning for delaying solo story when some people definitely can't be assed to find people to run content with, especially when, like I said, solo story is an inevitability and there's almost no reason to delay it, espeically when chaos vellum is literally end game content for the next 20 versions.

Edit: On a side note, you might wonder why I even care since I no longer play this server. I literally played for like a year and a half, with the latter half of it hoping the server would get better since theres so much potential. The fact that adding MPE greens is even a discussion is such a turn off because it shows how conservative of a balance approach admins and those who contribute to their opinions, decide to take. If MPE greens are really a problem, they can be removed, but don't dismiss them before even adding them in. It's not the same, but it's almost like that whole discussion of whether or not we should've made new cubes for legendary potential, like why was that even a discussion.
 
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mitbuiviet

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About where it can be obtained from: Root Abyss coin shop.
Currently the coins from RA bosses have no actually use besides key purchase, and CRA coins have no use at all. If this potion is meant to be used by everyone it should be obtainable from this shop since from level 100 you can start to do RA daily and have around 2~3 extra coins assuming you use them to buy keys. I suggest 1 MPE green potion = 25 Yggdrasil coins or 5 Chaos Yggdrasil coins.
We can even put them in Murt's Croosade coin shop for 5 coins each.
 

Skirch

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I'm hugely in favor of this as long as you have to get the potions yourself, MPE Green potions open up a lot of possibilities in terms of what you look for in gear as well as what attacks you use.
 

Marcus

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If they're added to the game i just hope they'll be rare enough to be a special occasion potion rather than just popping one casually like it's a warrior pill without giving it a second thought
 

Krydon

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Why is this even a discussion honestly, the potion is needed period. especially soon when harder bosses will be released.. the potion can help a lot on the way.
 

Mufasa

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I mean there was a point where admins decided to add naricains to the game. No one cared that it was a power creep then, how is that situation different from now.

If you want to do content in a party, you are free to do so, but don't try to create some bullshit reasoning for delaying solo story when some people definitely can't be assed to find people to run content with, especially when, like I said, solo story is an inevitability and there's almost no reason to delay it, espeically when chaos vellum is literally end game content for the next 20 versions.

Edit: On a side note, you might wonder why I even care since I no longer play this server. I literally played for like a year and a half, with the latter half of it hoping the server would get better since theres so much potential. The fact that adding MPE greens is even a discussion is such a turn off because it shows how conservative of a balance approach admins and those who contribute to their opinions, decide to take. If MPE greens are really a problem, they can be removed, but don't dismiss them before even adding them in. It's not the same, but it's almost like that whole discussion of whether or not we should've made new cubes for legendary potential, like why was that even a discussion.

The reason no one cared about narcs back then is because power creep wasn't that bad at that point.
Why should the game became solostory, and what does it need to happen faster? Is it because as you say people can't be assed to find others to do things with? They're playing an mmorpg, not a single player game. And as I've said before, this server has been against most of the incredible power creep, why should that change now? There's plenty of things that are inevitable, yet we try to stall and combat those.
However, if you do have a valid point as to why this is actually needed and not just preferred to have just to make things easier I'd like to hear it.
 

Threat

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The reason no one cared about narcs back then is because power creep wasn't that bad at that point.
Why should the game became solostory, and what does it need to happen faster? Is it because as you say people can't be assed to find others to do things with? They're playing an mmorpg, not a single player game. And as I've said before, this server has been against most of the incredible power creep, why should that change now? There's plenty of things that are inevitable, yet we try to stall and combat those.
However, if you do have a valid point as to why this is actually needed and not just preferred to have just to make things easier I'd like to hear it.
I'm sorry but the people who play maple story, especially older versions like this are fully aware of how the game is at this point in time. Just because it's an mmorpg doesn't mean that party related content is a must. You're basically forcing people to conform to what you envision an mmorpg is rather than how maple story actually was at these versions. I imagine a good chunk of people who play this server aspire to do things they couldn't do back when they played GMS 6 years ago. Things like soloing cvellum, not some group party play to knock down harder bosses, because for this era of maple story that's exactly what it was, SOLO STORY.

Also it's not like MPE greens are suddenly gonna make you kill cvellum if you weren't already killing it or had the potential to kill it. You still need to know the mechanics and dodge things lmao. I think you're overexaggerating the power creep, esp when dmg cap is hard capped at 50m, and the fastest most classes can even solo cvell while capping is like 10-11mins? Unless you're on a broken class on a broken patch.
 

Momori

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Definetly here for Green Potions. I think they should've been added a long time ago. Also it balances out a few classes and make them more viable.
For know, to kill the strongest bosses in game, you have to play the top DPS classes. By adding the Green Pots, we have more classes to jugle with.

As to how to implement them, I really like @mitbuiviet suggestion.
 

Mufasa

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it's not like MPE greens are suddenly gonna make you kill cvellum if you weren't already killing it or had the potential to kill it. You still need to know the mechanics and dodge things lmao.
This is a pretty good example. If before you needed a full squad to kill it, you could now run with 1 or 2 people less. Essentially making it possible to make more squads to take it down since you can run with smaller squads.
Now, there's squads that know the mechanics, just lacks the damage currently to take it down. But popping a green potion could give them the damage needed to take it down, since it's quite a huge boost. So instead of upgrading your gear, you can simply pop a potion. It's just making things easier for the sake of making it easier. Not because it's needed.

It is not based on what I envision, it based on how the staff has handled power creep in the past. Since it's up for discussion, it's clear an item like this has a huge impact on the game and endgame bossing.

However Momori actually does have a good point of some classes in general being much weaker than others and giving them a better and a more fair chance to kill something like cvel. However, that doesn't only make the weaker classes stronger. It's also making the strong classes even stronger. It sadly doesn't balance anything.
 

Threat

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This is a pretty good example. If before you needed a full squad to kill it, you could now run with 1 or 2 people less. Essentially making it possible to make more squads to take it down since you can run with smaller squads.
Now, there's squads that know the mechanics, just lacks the damage currently to take it down. But popping a green potion could give them the damage needed to take it down, since it's quite a huge boost. So instead of upgrading your gear, you can simply pop a potion. It's just making things easier for the sake of making it easier. Not because it's needed.

It is not based on what I envision, it based on how the staff has handled power creep in the past. Since it's up for discussion, it's clear an item like this has a huge impact on the game and endgame bossing.

However Momori actually does have a good point of some classes in general being much weaker than others and giving them a better and a more fair chance to kill something like cvel. However, that doesn't only make the weaker classes stronger. It's also making the strong classes even stronger. It sadly doesn't balance anything.
I mean these conservative thoughts and decisions are what caused a pretty significant exodus from the server ~4 months ago. Repeating the same mistakes is just gonna bring the same results :)
 

Mufasa

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I mean these conservative thoughts and decisions are what caused a pretty significant exodus from the server ~4 months ago. Repeating the same mistakes is just gonna bring the same results :)
Or making mistakes like this will result in that same thing.
 

ForumUser101

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This is a pretty good example. If before you needed a full squad to kill it, you could now run with 1 or 2 people less. Essentially making it possible to make more squads to take it down since you can run with smaller squads.
Now, there's squads that know the mechanics, just lacks the damage currently to take it down. But popping a green potion could give them the damage needed to take it down, since it's quite a huge boost. So instead of upgrading your gear, you can simply pop a potion. It's just making things easier for the sake of making it easier. Not because it's needed.

It is not based on what I envision, it based on how the staff has handled power creep in the past. Since it's up for discussion, it's clear an item like this has a huge impact on the game and endgame bossing.

However Momori actually does have a good point of some classes in general being much weaker than others and giving them a better and a more fair chance to kill something like cvel. However, that doesn't only make the weaker classes stronger. It's also making the strong classes even stronger. It sadly doesn't balance anything.
I am sorry? How overpowered do you think green potions can get you? If squads can already run with 2 less person, that doesnt mean green potions were the culprit. It just means they spent alot of effort into their gears to bring them this far. Everything you said so far was just filled with your own cowardice of the inevitable. What I have seen so far is that your comments lack any logical explaination and what your saying is just the staff's opinion and your own.
 

Lifer

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I am sorry? How overpowered do you think green potions can get you? If squads can already run with 2 less person, that doesnt mean green potions were the culprit. It just means they spent alot of effort into their gears to bring them this far. Everything you said so far was just filled with your own cowardice of the inevitable. What I have seen so far is that your comments lack any logical explaination and what your saying is just the staff's opinion and your own.
Imagine creating a new account joined 15min ago just to be sarcastic to others...
Back to topic, I feel MPE potion is needed and the way to implement it is either as @mitbuiviet said earlier or putting in boss coin shop, the same way as narc and cauldron. However, the price of MPE potion could be a bit higher than narc and cauldron since it's giving a more significant buff, but the exact price / place to put can just go under admin's discretion.
edit: nvm I'm blind didn't see Murt's shop has already been suggested
 
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